Comments on: Your Fast Donation Now Worth Double! http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648 A community working to end genocide Wed, 08 Sep 2010 08:11:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.1 By: megan fox http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-9121 megan fox Fri, 11 Sep 2009 15:52:21 +0000 http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-9121 Sign: umsun Hello!!! rcuwwymhyw and 5803ssgfhphzye and 7064I love your site. :) Love design!!! I just came across your blog and wanted to say that Ive really enjoyed browsing your blog posts. Sign: umsun Hello!!! rcuwwymhyw and 5803ssgfhphzye and 7064I love your site. :) Love design!!! I just came across your blog and wanted to say that Ive really enjoyed browsing your blog posts.

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By: sandrar http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-9118 sandrar Thu, 10 Sep 2009 19:21:23 +0000 http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-9118 Hi! I was surfing and found your blog post... nice! I love your blog. :) Cheers! Sandra. R. Hi! I was surfing and found your blog post… nice! I love your blog. :) Cheers! Sandra. R.

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By: Njmalhq (Najam Haq) http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-8648 Njmalhq (Najam Haq) Wed, 11 Mar 2009 22:05:54 +0000 http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-8648 The political utility of under-application of the term Genocide is in no way lower than over-application of it. A murder rate of 1 per 1000 per day isn't inherently implausible. Even strictly on mechanical grounds. What, a thousand people can not kill one person? All it really takes is one. Murder of 800,000 people over 100 days comes down to 8,000 people per day. Not all that implausible. A kill ratio of 1-to-1 requires only 8,000 murderers, or 0.1% (1 per 1000) of the 8 million population to go on a daily murder spree. Don't forget, murder unchecked is infinitely repeatable. If they took weekends off, they'd need to increase their membership by 3,111 additional murderers. Killing semi-daily requires only 16,000 total murderers. If the murderers held day jobs, working on murder only on weekends, there would have to be a mere 26,666 of them to pull this kind of genocide off. But it gets worse. The murderous capacities of those who wish to indulge that lust isn't limited by medieval technological constraints any more, when a sword could only every kill one person at a time. Today a commonly available pistol can kill 6 within a very short window of time. An Uzi can kill 50. A bomb can kill thousands. A nuke can kill millions. All can be wielded by a small number of individuals. So a very conservative kill ratio of 1-to-5 requires anywhere between 1,600 and 5,000 appropriately armed murderers to very practically wipe out 800,000 unarmed civilians within a few weeks (BTW, Rwanda is a very small country, less than 150 miles at its widest, so spacial constraints are also very minimal there). While abhorrent, these are not implausible numbers. And, even more disturbingly, the numbers can get even worse. I don't think the lower murder rates Mr. Mahmoud speaks of have much to do with the Nazi regime's capacity for genocide. If they didn't murder people faster doesn't mean the couldn't have. Nor does it mean that they held their hand (if indeed they did that) out of the goodness of their hearts. They were using their victims as slave labor. I read in a book once that the murder of one is as awful as the murder of all. So maybe numbers aren't even worth dawdling over in such matters. Saving lives is what should take priority. Unless politicizing is all we are after. <blockquote> "In the social equation, the value of a single life is nil; in the cosmic equation, it is infinite ... any political movement which implicitly relies on purely utilitarian ethics, must become a victim to the same fatal error. It is a fallacy as naïve as a mathematical teaser, and yet its consequences lead straight to Goya's Disasters, to the reign of the guillotine, the torture chambers of the Inquisition, or the cellars of the Lubianka." (Arthur Koestler from The Invisible Writing)" </blockquote> The political utility of under-application of the term Genocide is in no way lower than over-application of it.

A murder rate of 1 per 1000 per day isn’t inherently implausible. Even strictly on mechanical grounds. What, a thousand people can not kill one person? All it really takes is one.

Murder of 800,000 people over 100 days comes down to 8,000 people per day. Not all that implausible. A kill ratio of 1-to-1 requires only 8,000 murderers, or 0.1% (1 per 1000) of the 8 million population to go on a daily murder spree. Don’t forget, murder unchecked is infinitely repeatable. If they took weekends off, they’d need to increase their membership by 3,111 additional murderers. Killing semi-daily requires only 16,000 total murderers. If the murderers held day jobs, working on murder only on weekends, there would have to be a mere 26,666 of them to pull this kind of genocide off.

But it gets worse. The murderous capacities of those who wish to indulge that lust isn’t limited by medieval technological constraints any more, when a sword could only every kill one person at a time. Today a commonly available pistol can kill 6 within a very short window of time. An Uzi can kill 50. A bomb can kill thousands. A nuke can kill millions. All can be wielded by a small number of individuals. So a very conservative kill ratio of 1-to-5 requires anywhere between 1,600 and 5,000 appropriately armed murderers to very practically wipe out 800,000 unarmed civilians within a few weeks (BTW, Rwanda is a very small country, less than 150 miles at its widest, so spacial constraints are also very minimal there). While abhorrent, these are not implausible numbers. And, even more disturbingly, the numbers can get even worse.

I don’t think the lower murder rates Mr. Mahmoud speaks of have much to do with the Nazi regime’s capacity for genocide. If they didn’t murder people faster doesn’t mean the couldn’t have. Nor does it mean that they held their hand (if indeed they did that) out of the goodness of their hearts. They were using their victims as slave labor.

I read in a book once that the murder of one is as awful as the murder of all. So maybe numbers aren’t even worth dawdling over in such matters. Saving lives is what should take priority. Unless politicizing is all we are after.

“In the social equation, the value of a single life is nil; in the cosmic equation, it is infinite … any political movement which implicitly relies on purely utilitarian ethics, must become a victim to the same fatal error. It is a fallacy as naïve as a mathematical teaser, and yet its consequences lead straight to Goya’s Disasters, to the reign of the guillotine, the torture chambers of the Inquisition, or the cellars of the Lubianka.” (Arthur Koestler from The Invisible Writing)”

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By: joe aloha http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-8622 joe aloha Fri, 06 Feb 2009 16:42:13 +0000 http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-8622 correct me if i am wrong, i believe all of africa is the richest country in the world. In materials underground. oil, minerals, metals, sorry but i just can not find the word to describe all of these, anyway there are those with access to all these, and they do not want to share the wealth. you know who these folks are and maybe you have asked, or maybe not. but they are responsible for all these atrocities. they are the ones who make trouble for all of the population. i guess i have to leave it to GOD to be my avenger, but you know we the people in the US, such as me feel so responsible for these atrocities because i need oil for my car, i am a consumer and many of these needs are connected to countries like these who are suffering while these companies do not want to share the wealth they are also ripping people like me off and making profits both sides. Also the ones that have the power to stop this do not want to, because their getting a cut and are afraid to do anything. i wish so much for justice but my peers, especially in america, say there is nothing you can do about it so just enjoy what you can. WHAT A SIN,i am sorry, but even i do not have enough resources to help. GOD WILL BE THE AVENGER. correct me if i am wrong, i believe all of africa is the richest country in the world. In materials underground. oil, minerals, metals, sorry but i just can not find the word to describe all of these, anyway there are those with access to all these, and they do not want to share the wealth. you know who these folks are and maybe you have asked, or maybe not. but they are responsible for all these atrocities. they are the ones who make trouble for all of the population. i guess i have to leave it to GOD to be my avenger, but you know we the people in the US, such as me feel so responsible for these atrocities because i need oil for my car, i am a consumer and many of these needs are connected to countries like these who are suffering while these companies do not want to share the wealth they are also ripping people like me off and making profits both sides. Also the ones that have the power to stop this do not want to, because their getting a cut and are afraid to do anything. i wish so much for justice but my peers, especially in america, say there is nothing you can do about it so just enjoy what you can. WHAT A SIN,i am sorry, but even i do not have enough resources to help. GOD WILL BE THE AVENGER.

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By: Tariq Mahmood http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-7905 Tariq Mahmood Sun, 20 Jul 2008 08:08:48 +0000 http://stopgenocidenow.org/home/2008/06/27/648#comment-7905 Yes I believe Genocide is a myth. Nearly every time it is applied to a war or tragedy it is done so for political purposes. One Genocide I do believe in is the Nazi Slaughter of Jews, Slavs, and others before, during, and after (Nazi affiliated, and even Nazi resisters slaughtered the Jews for months after the Nazi's surrendered, particularly Polish freedom fighters and former Nazi Collaborators.) Now when we look at the Holocaust and Nazi slaughter of the Slavs we see the improbability of the figures presented in the media for Rwanda, Darfur, and just about every other would be Genocide being accurate portrayals of the violence. Throughout the whole Second World War 72 million people died of which 52 million where through violence and of which half were military losses. The war lasted over 1900 days and involved 15 million German military personnel, 34 million Russian military personnel, 15 Million American and 11 million British Personnel. The war also involved millions of other military personnel from Japan, Italy, France, Hungary, Poland, and other nations. The war was clearly a huge undertakening, involving TRILLIONS upon TRILLIONS of Man hours of effort from HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of people who served as soldiers, who built the ammunitions used in the war, who built the lines of communications and infrastructure to run the war, grew the food to feed the workers and soldiers to carry on the efforts to engage in the war. A HUGE UNDERTAKING. Now look at Rwanada, a nation of 8 million people (or so we are told, no one really knows how many people live in these third world countries, we in the U.S. don't even know how many illegal citizens live in this country), yet we are to believe that over 100 days (the second world war lasted over 1800 days), 800,000 people were slaughted (A DEATH RATE of 1 PER 1,000 PER DAY versus A DEATH RATE of 0.0185 PER 1,000 PER DAY for all nations involved in World War II. ) The most heavily affected nations Russia, Germany, and Poland experienced losses of 36 million people over 1900 days and had a combined population in excess of 272 million. This comes out a DEATH RATE of roughly 0.0695 PER THOUSAND PER DAY. Given all of the above how is is possible that even Rwanda could have a death rate per thousand per day over 50 times the World War 2 average and 15 times the most heavily affected nations? Rwanada and Darfur can't even compared to pre industrial Europe, these death tolls are inflated. The regime in Khartoum can't even maintain more then 80,000 soldiers, how can they engineer a Genocide against 5 million people? Yes I believe Genocide is a myth. Nearly every time it is applied to a war or tragedy it is done so for political purposes.

One Genocide I do believe in is the Nazi Slaughter of Jews, Slavs, and others before, during, and after (Nazi affiliated, and even Nazi resisters slaughtered the Jews for months after the Nazi’s surrendered, particularly Polish freedom fighters and former Nazi Collaborators.)

Now when we look at the Holocaust and Nazi slaughter of the Slavs we see the improbability of the figures presented in the media for Rwanda, Darfur, and just about every other would be Genocide being accurate portrayals of the violence.

Throughout the whole Second World War 72 million people died of which 52 million where through violence and of which half were military losses. The war lasted over 1900 days and involved 15 million German military personnel, 34 million Russian military personnel, 15 Million American and 11 million British Personnel.

The war also involved millions of other military personnel from Japan, Italy, France, Hungary, Poland, and other nations. The war was clearly a huge undertakening, involving TRILLIONS upon TRILLIONS of Man hours of effort from HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of people who served as soldiers, who built the ammunitions used in the war, who built the lines of communications and infrastructure to run the war, grew the food to feed the workers and soldiers to carry on the efforts to engage in the war.

A HUGE UNDERTAKING.

Now look at Rwanada, a nation of 8 million people (or so we are told, no one really knows how many people live in these third world countries, we in the U.S. don’t even know how many illegal citizens live in this country), yet we are to believe that over 100 days (the second world war lasted over 1800 days), 800,000 people were slaughted (A DEATH RATE of 1 PER 1,000 PER DAY versus A DEATH RATE of 0.0185 PER 1,000 PER DAY for all nations involved in World War II. )

The most heavily affected nations Russia, Germany, and Poland experienced losses of 36 million people over 1900 days and had a combined population in excess of 272 million. This comes out a DEATH RATE of roughly 0.0695 PER THOUSAND PER DAY.

Given all of the above how is is possible that even Rwanda could have a death rate per thousand per day over 50 times the World War 2 average and 15 times the most heavily affected nations?

Rwanada and Darfur can’t even compared to pre industrial Europe, these death tolls are inflated. The regime in Khartoum can’t even maintain more then 80,000 soldiers, how can they engineer a Genocide against 5 million people?

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